Issue 40747

Summary: Two seperate commands both named Insert>Formula
Product: General Reporter: ed2 <hand_of_fate2000>
Component: uiAssignee: AOO issues mailing list <issues>
Status: CONFIRMED --- QA Contact:
Severity: Trivial    
Priority: P3 CC: cmoulin, diaz_frederic, eric.bachard, eric.savary, frank.loehmann, haxwell, issues, jbf.faure, lapsap7+ooo, Mathias_Bauer, michael.cziebalski, pescetti, rb.henschel
Version: 680m74Keywords: oooqa
Target Milestone: ---   
Hardware: All   
OS: All   
Issue Type: DEFECT Latest Confirmation in: ---
Developer Difficulty: Easy
Issue Depends on: 99468    
Issue Blocks:    
Attachments:
Description Flags
Patch to help solving the issue, backported from OOo4Kids none

Description ed2 2005-01-16 17:40:39 UTC
In the Tools>Customize...>Toolbars>Add.. dialog box, selecting "Insert" from the
"Category" list yields two entries both called "Formula" in the "Commands" box.
Only the different icons next to these commands reveal that one is to insert an
OOo Math object, and the other is to open the Formula Bar.

Under Tools>Customize...>Keyboard the situation is even worse, since no icons
are dispalyed next to commands in the "Function" list, so there is absolutely
nothing to distinguish these identically named commands!

Before OOO2 becomes final, it will be necessary to rename one (or both) of these
commands, in order to remove this ambiguity. (The command names WERE different
in OOo1!)
Comment 1 thorsten.martens 2005-01-18 10:23:29 UTC
Not reproducible in a more recent m72 build. No duplicate entries !
Comment 2 thorsten.martens 2005-01-18 10:23:46 UTC
closed
Comment 3 ed2 2005-01-28 16:31:35 UTC
I have checked this in the latest release (m74), and it certainly IS
reproducible, just as I described, and not solved at all!

PS - Will you PLEASE stop saying that an issue is "resolved in 1.9mX", when:

*  1.9mX doesn't even exist yet
*  When 1.9mX finally is released, the issue hasn't changes one bit since it was
reported.

Dishonestly caliming that an issue is resolved does nothing to actually resolve
the issue, and causes much frustartion to anyone with an interest in that issue!
Comment 4 gandhis 2005-02-04 22:36:56 UTC
(Aditi Gupta , Seema Gandhi , February 04, 2005 5:33 PM)

We successfully replicated the bug on Windows 2000 SP4 in Open Office 1.9.71.1.
The same steps were followed to reproduce the bug. 
Many entries in the Commands Box have a description; since both “Formula” 
entries have an ambiguity in their names it is confusing that Formula with the 
icon f(x) does not have a description.
Comment 5 haxwell 2005-02-07 21:32:23 UTC
Confirmed in 1.9.74.

PS - ed2 I completely agree with you :)
Comment 6 mci 2005-03-03 11:24:15 UTC
Hi ed2,

thanks for using and supporting OpenOffice.org...

1. One problem per issue please... In the following I refer to the "duplicate"
names in that dialog...
2. Please don't shout at us...
3. Please don't call us "liars", thanks...
The fact that you can't reach the version tm mentioned does not mean that this
version doesn't exist! 

4. hhmmm, you are right, ...
- one of the entries is used for calculating something (e.g. in Writer)
- the other entry is used to insert a formula and opens the formula editor.
I agree that there should be a difference in the naming...

reassigned to cj

mci -> cj:
Hi cj, 
please have a look at this issue, thanks
IMHO this double used name is confusing.
The description in the dialog shows the difference but maybe it is possible to
fine a better name for one of the entries
Comment 7 mci 2005-03-03 11:38:05 UTC
cc'ed mci
Comment 8 matthias.mueller-prove 2005-05-10 14:47:12 UTC
Regarding Tools>Customize>Toolbars>Add OOo offers
1) tool tips
2) a discription
3) a different icon
At the bottom line the user has a fare chance to distinguish the items.

Regarding Tools>Customize>Keyboard
I second this. The situation leaves just guessing to the user. This has to be
chantged for OOoLater.

Comment 9 Regina Henschel 2008-10-06 17:55:31 UTC
*** Issue 94704 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***
Comment 10 jbf.faure 2009-02-18 04:49:57 UTC
Hi,

I don't understand why it is so difficult to add "Math" or "Calc" to the label
"Formula" as it points to Math equation editor or recalculable formula bar.
Another solution is to rename Math Formula in Equation.

From my point of view it is a defect to have the same name for two differents
functions -> issue type changed to defect.

Regards
JBF

Comment 11 eric.savary 2009-02-18 06:22:12 UTC
Because it is not simply a question of renaming a string from A to B.
This is a general problem which needs a redesign of the dialog and the way we
display functions names.
-> Enhancement.
Comment 12 settantta 2009-02-18 06:26:36 UTC
I checked using 3.0.0 under Linux and Win XP Pro. I can confirm that these
duplicate entries exist, however they only occur when one is using Writer. 

I opened a new spreadsheet, only one entry for Formula under either dialog.

However, with a Writer document open, the duplicate entries are there, as
described by the reporter.

They do not appear when using Draw or Impress either.

It would appear that this is specific to Calc.
Comment 13 eric.bachard 2009-02-18 08:08:12 UTC
Sad to see this issue is not yet solved : this is an extremely bad user experience and pro Microsoft 
people are laughing.

Why is it so difficult to add Math / Calc ? the fix is  one liner, and the promised enhancement means 
"years" (if ever it occurs a day ... )
 
@es : "enhancement" means years, and we need an urgent fix.  A good compromise is to temporarly fix 
that ( the fix is probably a one-liner !! ) and if you propose enhancement, nobody will cry.

I'll blog about this issue.



Comment 14 eric.savary 2009-02-18 09:23:14 UTC
@ericb: instead of blogging and that we infinitely discuss if this issue is an
apple or a fruit (it's both!) and if this is a "1 liner": please submit a patch!

@MBA: please help!
- if we decide to fix only those two entries by renaming them (which may have
consequences on the translation!), yes this is a defect, this is (I guess) easy
to fix but this is not a solution because...

- every application is affected by duplicate entries (see issue 99333) because
the concept of this dialog is not optimal: tipps or function descriptions are
missing, we have no way internally to check for duplicate strings and every new
UI function is automatically added to this dialog without any review from
anybody about the *context* of this dialog...

Adding this info is an enhancement, needs UI changes, an I-Team and
documentation on it.

This last solution is my favorite because it's not a hack but a concept
improvement. I volunteer to be part of the I-team!

MBA, please your point of view.
Comment 15 ed2 2009-02-18 17:48:28 UTC
@es:
What is your interest in making a perfectly trivial issue sound so much more
complicated that it really is? To state in simple terms:

The problem:
Two different commands are both named "insert formula".

The solution:
Change the name of one or both commands.

That is all there is to it. Making this one simple change IS a solution to this
problem, and IS a one-liner! Any other change is a separate issue, and should be
dealt with as such.
Comment 16 eric.savary 2009-02-18 18:21:39 UTC
@ed2: same answer as for ericb. If it's so easy, please submit a patch.
Comment 17 ed2 2009-02-18 18:43:45 UTC
Is a patch really necessary to change the displayed name of a single command?
What would a patch for such a trivial change contain anyway?

All that is required is for someone who knows where the displayed names of these
commands are stored in the source files to change one of them.

What patch does anyone need to change one line of text? How would any patch help
them do this anyway?
Comment 18 Mathias_Bauer 2009-02-19 15:01:16 UTC
While es is completely right about the problems of this dialog (and so correctly
pointed out that there is something to do) I don't see a problem in doing a
simple fix for the duplicate "insert formula" entries.

The next interesting question is: which name should be changed and how should it
be? My suggestion: 

"Insert formula object" or "Insert Math object"

as this function appears in the "Insert Object" menu of the application.

The other function can keep its current name, I don't see a better one.
Comment 19 ed2 2009-02-19 17:43:49 UTC
While there may be other issues (no one ever said this was the one and only
issue ever to affect OOo), the point remains that THIS ISSUE is the duplicate
"insert formula" commands. Any other design change is a SEPARATE ISSUE, and
should be reported and processed as such.

The obvious solution is to change the command for inserting an OOo Math object
to "Insert Math Object". Indeed this is what the command was called in previous
versions.
Comment 20 Mathias_Bauer 2009-02-19 18:37:34 UTC
This is a framework issue and must be fixed in the "global commands".

Carsten, please take over. 
Comment 21 eric.bachard 2009-02-20 07:47:41 UTC
@mba

Thank you for your answer, but I'm curious, and I'd like to 1) understand and 2)
help to fix that. 

So I have a simple question: *where* are exactly located the relevant strings ?
I'm searching since two days (lot of "Formule" and "Formula" in OOo code, I can
modify a lot of menus, renaming the with funky names, to be sure it works, _but_
I was not able to modify these entries :-/  

FYI I modified strings in localize.sdf, or .src (using a correct editor) in 
sfx2, svx, sw, sc, vcl and svtools, even in some .xml files). Once modified the
source, I have rebuilt the matching .res and tested them afterward.

Just the filename + relevant lines would be sufficient, and I think I can do the
rest.

This way, I could provide very fastly a Mac OS X build to my testers, as proof
of concept. Last, if you need help for the cws (not sure, because this is
localization stuff), you can count on me once I'll be back from holidays
(starting 2nd of March), or before if made today ( but we'll have to be fast ).

Thanks in advance :)

Comment 22 Mathias_Bauer 2009-02-20 08:34:37 UTC
IIRC these strings are part of a "...commands.xcu" file, most probably the
global commands.
Comment 23 eric.bachard 2009-02-20 09:56:00 UTC
Ok, thank you. If I can find some time, I'll give it a try this afternoon
Comment 24 eric.savary 2009-02-20 13:50:30 UTC
@ericb: I asked CD who confirmed what I thought...

The entries in the ICU file are used from *both* "Tools - Customize" and the
Menu UI names. Thus, changing the string you see in the Customize dialog will
also change the Menu UI name.

Hint: for Math objects (the second entry) you may choose something like "Math
object" or better "formula (Math object)" and NOT "Insert Math object" because
the menu would then look like:
Insert
->...
Object*** -> OLE object
             Plugin
             Sound
             Video
             Insert Math object
             Chart

Which is ugly...

(*** Well currently called "Draw objects" which is another bug we have on track!)

And while you're at it, you can also avoid a similar context translation error
while submitting a correct translation also for French, don't you? ;)

Nonetheless I'll file a meta task for the general problem and set this issue as
blocking the meta task. :)
Comment 25 Mathias_Bauer 2009-02-20 14:06:15 UTC
So the name should be "Math object". "Insert" should be the name of the group
(and IIRC it is).
Comment 26 ed2 2009-02-20 17:29:11 UTC
This issue does not depend on 99468.

If anything 99464 DEPENDS ON THIS ISSUE, but certainly not the other way round.
Comment 27 sgautier.ooo 2009-02-20 18:30:40 UTC
So the string might be this one:
officecfg	registry\data\org\openoffice\Office\UI\WriterCommands.xcu	0	value
..WriterCommands.UserInterface.Commands..uno:InsertObjectStarMath	Label			0
en-US	~Formula				2002-02-02 02:02:02
Comment 28 eric.savary 2009-02-20 18:45:52 UTC
Issue 99468 is a meta issue.

Issues related to the general problem described in issue 99468 will be marked as
"depends on" in order to keep a track of them.

So this is only an administrative measure and DOESN'T mean the "depending on"
issues will be fixed after the the main one. They can be fixed before (MBA
targeted 3.2 while the general task will certainly not be fixed for 3.2).

Now please, you have contribute reporting this task, let the developers now fix,
the QA folks verify and set administrative fields.

The fix is on its way :)
Comment 29 ed2 2009-02-20 21:29:57 UTC
What exactly does "depends on" mean on this site? I always assumed that the site
was in English, and in English "This issue deopends on Issue 99468" means that
it requires Issue 99468 to be solved before this one can be.

That is not the case. One duplicate can perfectly well be resolved on its own
without any requirement for all other duplicates to be resolved. It would,
however, make sense to say that resolving all duplicates requires this one to be
resolved. Hence the dependency between these two issues as it stands is the
wrong way round.
Comment 30 eric.savary 2009-02-21 11:57:59 UTC
*** Issue 54359 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***
Comment 31 carsten.driesner 2009-10-27 14:36:32 UTC
cd: We missed the OOo 3.2 release and I have to  shift this issue to the next
release.
Comment 32 diaz_frederic 2010-04-09 20:42:58 UTC
In the OOo3.2.0 code, Formula above (which was a Calc one)
and Formula under (which was a Math one) have been swapped.

Now, the first Formula is Math and the second Formula is Calc.

It was not a very good idea to permute them.
Now we should rewrite all the documentation/howtos about this subject 

May be would it be possible to swap them again for the next version,
it would avoid us to rewrite documentation. :-)
Comment 33 meywer 2010-04-11 17:49:04 UTC
> In the OOo3.2.0 code, Formula above (which was a Calc one)
> and Formula under (which was a Math one) have been swapped.
>
> It was not a very good idea to permute them.
> Now we should rewrite all the documentation/howtos about this subject 

Better solution:
different (and self-explaning) names for all "functions"
Comment 34 diaz_frederic 2010-06-21 16:51:44 UTC
Pb Solved in OOo4Kids-0.9.5 (june 2010) by E. Bachard
(education.openoffice.org Lead)
both functions have now self-explaining names.
interested people can have a look at its source code for backport.
Comment 35 carsten.driesner 2010-08-25 09:40:06 UTC
cd: Too much issues for OOo 3.3 release. Have to move it to the next release.

cd->diaz_frederic: Thanks for the pointer to OOo4Kids-0.9.5. I will try to back
port your solution to OOo for 3.4.

If you believe that this issue should be handled as a showstopper for OOo3.3
please nominate it accordingly in the releases mailing list.
Comment 36 diaz_frederic 2010-08-25 22:33:27 UTC
I don't believe it's realy a showstopper because it is neither a severe bug nor
a regression, and many others issues are more urgent.

But if you can solve the problem for 3.4 it will be a good thing.
Comment 37 eric.bachard 2010-08-26 12:45:35 UTC
@cd : if this can help you, I can provide a patch, based on DEV300 (m83 or m84 if I'm not wrong), 
showing you the changes I did.

This should show you the exact constant names I modified, and will avoid you to search the right string, 
and the rest will IMHO be a NLC affair.

Comment 38 carsten.driesner 2010-08-31 13:03:15 UTC
@ericb : Hi Eric, please attach a patch for this issue and I will gladly
integrate it into OOo.
Comment 39 eric.bachard 2010-08-31 13:12:18 UTC
@cd : the patch I'll attach is not the solution, because every NLC will have to translate the strings, but the 
missing information who will save you a lot of time.

Comment 40 eric.bachard 2010-08-31 13:13:25 UTC
Created attachment 71502 [details]
Patch to help solving the issue, backported from OOo4Kids
Comment 41 Martin Hollmichel 2011-03-15 20:59:56 UTC
set target to 3.x since not release relevant for 3.4 release.
Comment 42 Andrea Pescetti 2012-01-29 16:11:55 UTC
*** Issue 84354 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***
Comment 43 Regina Henschel 2013-09-23 18:57:22 UTC
I think, the patch is not usable, because
(1)
"Calc Formula" gives confusion with the application Calc.
(2)
"Math Formula" and "Calc Formula" still use the same word "Formula".
(3)
.uno:InsertObjectStarMath is a common command, and in the meantime it is in GenericCommands.xcu
(4)
.sdf files are not manipulated directly, but by translation via Pootle.
Comment 44 Regina Henschel 2013-09-23 18:59:48 UTC
*** Issue 123333 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***
Comment 45 Regina Henschel 2014-09-22 15:42:11 UTC
The attached patch is obsolete because of structural changes in the code.