Apache OpenOffice (AOO) Bugzilla – Full Text Issue Listing |
Summary: | Numbered chapter styles behave erratically; hard numbers should turn to outlines when assigning heading style | ||||||
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Product: | Writer | Reporter: | nmailhot <nicolas.mailhot> | ||||
Component: | formatting | Assignee: | michael.ruess | ||||
Status: | CLOSED FIXED | QA Contact: | issues@sw <issues> | ||||
Severity: | Trivial | ||||||
Priority: | P3 | CC: | cno, eliyuan, frank.loehmann, issues | ||||
Version: | OOo 2.0.1 | ||||||
Target Milestone: | --- | ||||||
Hardware: | All | ||||||
OS: | All | ||||||
Issue Type: | DEFECT | Latest Confirmation in: | --- | ||||
Developer Difficulty: | --- | ||||||
Attachments: |
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Description
nmailhot
2006-03-01 12:16:25 UTC
Could you please add a document to this issue and tell where in the doc you try to apply a heading number. Thank you very much. Created attachment 34525 [details]
Synthetic test case
I've attached a test case Not sure if it's representative, I can't send the actual company documents and their lifetime is a lot more complex than this one Main problem is probably than when you apply a § style which specifies numbering OO.o tries to keep other numbering styles applied, so you have two numberings fighting for the same § The paragarph "1. Foo 3" has a "hard" numbering. This will override the numbers assigned via "Tools.Outline Numbering" dialog. Click the "Numbering off" button (third in the toolbar) to correct this. A numbering has been assigned to this paragraph BEFORE it got the "Heading 3" style. When a numbering is assigned to a paragraph formatted with a heading style, it will be alsoassigned (as autonumbered outline) in the mentioned outline dialog. Closed. 1. Numbering off removes all numbering not just the hard numbering 2. when I apply a § style to a line I expect the § style to be honoured regardless of previous styling (it's very easy for example to start a new chapter after a bullet/number list, so the initial line before you apply "title" style already got some residual numbering attribute) 3. like I wrote this behaviour is devilish because with all the hard/soft numbering interactions when OO.o reloads a document it does not always make the same numbering decisions it did at save time (so all titles may be numbered when you save but not anymore when you load the document, because you've been clicking on the numbering button to correct things but actually styling was all right so when you reload your manual "corrections" get in the way) 4. also even if the technical behaviour was right (it isn't) the ergonomy is terrible. You think this is a small problem because you have a one-page doc but with 100-page documents with cascading numbering effects (amplifying software and user mistakes) this is killing me ad 1) this behaviour is normally intended. If you have a paragraph with valid outline numbering (the numbering type is applied to a style in Tools.Outline dialog) this button will influence the settings for the affected level. This is desired by the community (see "Numbering" specification on specs.openoffice.org). ad 2) This is truely a thing that we should enhance. It might be more desirable to turn the "hard" number into an outline number when changing the style of a paragraph into a heading paragraph which is applied in Tools.Outline dialog. We will handle it in this issue. ad 3) I have not seen a number turning into a wrong thing when saving/reloading a document. We should have a real situation to reproduce the problem. I would requst you to file this into a new issue (because there should be listed only one problem in one issue, following the issue rules/guidelines). If you experience a situation where there is an inconsistency in numbering, state that in a new issue and attach a document if possible. ad 4) MRU->OD: when there is a non-heading paragraph which is numbered, the number should turn into an outline number when a heading style will be applied to the paragraph. The "competitor" also does this, and as described by "nmailhot" it is much easier handling and will meet the users expectations. FL, do we need a spec change for this? FL: I think this is a goog idea. Would this change the appearance of old documents? The attached demo document has no outline numbering turned on in the outline dialog, even if turned on by using the numbering button on a outline paragraph like "heading 1". Do we want to change this for OOo 2.0.3? The given document shows the following inconsistency or misuse, which seem to confuse the user: Paragraph style 'Heading 1' is assigned to outline level 1. Thus, the internal numbering rule 'outline' is applied to this paragraph style. The 'outline' numbering is the numbering rule, which is edited in the 'outline numbering' dialog. But, this paragraph style has an own numbering rule set - namely numbering rule 'Numbering 1'. Thus, the 'outline' numbering rule is ruled out. The same holds for paragraph style 'Heading 2' and 'Heading 3'. In such a situation nobody - I say nobody - can except, that the appliance of one of these paragraph styles to a paragraph will result in a paragraph, which is numbered with the 'outline' numbering rule. In general: If a paragraph style is applied to a paragraph, one user expects that the paragraph keeps its own numbering attribute, because she has assigned this special attribute to the paragraph. Another user expects that the paragraphs own numbering attribute is deleted and the one of the applied paragraph style is used instead. Such a discussion can be made for every paragraph attribute. If you consider, that paragraph styles are also hierarchically organized, this discussion will become even more complex. In this special situation I proposed the following change: If a paragraph style, which is assigned to one of the outline levels and which has *no* own numbering rule set, is applied to a paragraph, the 'hard' numbering attributes of paragraphs are deleted and thus, the numbering attributes of the paragraph styles are applied. The following paragraph attributes are reset at the paragraph: - Numbering style - Numbering - Restart at this paragraph - Numbering - Start with This change is only performed, if the user applies a paragraph via the user interface. Thus, it will not change the appearance of 'old' documents. For me, the target of this change should be OOo 3.0 and this change should be treated as an enhancement. -> nmailhot, MRU and FL - please give your comments. I'm not sure I've followed the previous interventions - they're a bit too heavy in office suite techspeak for me. My needs as a stupid user are rather simple: when I apply a § style I expect the § style to overwrite the previous local formatting attributes. If I really want the § to be special I can re-apply specific formatting manually after setting the style. In particular when I apply a title style I am moving to a higher level than I was before, so whatever manual formatting occured at a lower level in the previous document part is moot at this point I hope you have less problems understanding my message than I have reading yours ;) As a general case OO.o is trying much too hard to preserve attributes and forgets a lot of them are the result of user mistakes, inheritance from previous unrelated lines, cut & paste from other documents, etc Too a point it's sometimes easier to do a cut/paste as plain text than try to sort the mess whithin the OO.o UI (even if that means removing manually the numbering the cut&paste transformed in real characters) OD->nmailhot: Sorry, that I confused you by my previous statements. Give me a second try: - The outline paragraph styles 'Heading 1', 'Heading 2' and 'Heading 3' - you name them 'title styles' - have a set numbering rule. Thus, the outline numbering rule isn't applied for these paragraph styles. - Deleting 'hard' attributes of a paragraph, when a paragraph style is applied, can be discussed controverse. Normally, the 'hard' attribute are deleted - exceptions are the numbering attributes and the break attributes. - For the given case - the numbering attributes - I'm partly on your side: delete the 'hard' numbering attributes, when the outline paragraph style hasn't got a own numbering rule. I think, I have to revise my propsal. I will discuss with MRU and FL, which are the conditions to delete the hard numbering attributes, when a outline paragraph style is applied. adjust target milestone to OOo 2.x *** Issue 71664 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. *** Could you add 79486 to this one also as I think they are related? There is an example document in that issue also that has temperamental behavior - this results in loss productivity of the user and great frustrations. OD, I'm not sure I follow. If I create a new document with a clean slate then are you saying there is "hard" numbering assigned to the Heading styles? If so, then that isn't right. The "hard" numbering should only be applied if the user goes to tools->outline numbering and _then_ decides to have hard numbering applied to those styles. I've created documents with only 2 types of styles - heading and default - and OO still seems to screw up the numbering sequence. I use the Heading styles as described in the OO help for creating paragraph sequences and it still gets confused. I realize that sometimes that this is a user problem but I have to tell you that I'm very methodical and thorough when trying to demonstrate a problem/bug and this behavior is extremely odd/counterintuitive/disruptive. I also don't follow your explanation of the discussion as to what is occurring. It's not so much the terminology but there are details that you know that are not included in the discussion such as, -what is "hard" numbering? -what is "soft" numbering? -how are styles automatically linked to outline styles? -which styles have numbering rule sets automatically applied? -which styles have outline styles automatically applied? These details are what create confusion and it would be good to define any terms used before discussing them. Your effort is to be applauded - thank you. The end result is that there is an inconsistent behavior that I can attribute to OO solely. I've spent hours/days (and several paper revisions) trying to figure out how OO functions and each time changing my thought process only to realize that OO is inconsistent and that no matter what I do, I can't get the behavior that is expected or desired. The problem may just lie in the fact that we're creating documents with pages upon pages and several layers of numbering and maybe these haven't been tested well enough - it's possible. accepted to this issue for OOo 2.4 Together with MRU I've decided to introduce the following change: If a paragraph style is applied to a paragraph or a group of paragraphs, the numbering attributes, which are explicit set at the paragraph/paragraphs, are clearer under one of the following conditions: - the paragraph style has explicit a certain numbering style set, or - the paragraph style has explicit "no numbering" set, or - the paragraph style inherits a certain numbering style from one of its parent styles, or - the paragraph style inherits "no numbering" from one of its parent styles. Term "numbering attributes" denotes the numbering style attribute, the "restart at" attribute and the "restart with" attribute. This solves the described defect, because a paragraph style, which is assigned to a certain outline level of the outline style, has explicit set the build-in outline numbering style. The implementation of this solution is in progress in cws sw8u10bf01 fixed in cws sw8u10bf01 - changed files: /sw/inc/doc.hxx, 1.142.56.1 /sw/inc/editsh.hxx, 1.59.60.1 /sw/source/core/doc/docfmt.cxx, 1.46.60.1 /sw/source/core/edit/edfcol.cxx, 1.9.62.1 /sw/source/ui/app/docst.cxx, 1.29.60.1 /sw/source/core/crsr/crstrvl.cxx, 1.22.60.1 /sw/source/core/doc/docredln.cxx, 1.46.62.1 /sw/source/filter/rtf/swparrtf.cxx, 1.74.60.1 OD->MRU: Checked in internal installation set of cws sw8u10bf01 - please verify. Verified in CWS sw8u10bf01. *** Issue 54707 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. *** Fixed in OO 2.4 -> closed. |