Issue 17056 - WW8: Word doesn't have "title case" character property
Summary: WW8: Word doesn't have "title case" character property
Alias: None
Product: Writer
Classification: Application
Component: code (show other issues)
Version: OOo 1.1 RC
Hardware: PC Windows 2000
: P3 Trivial (vote)
Target Milestone: ---
Assignee: michael.ruess
QA Contact: issues@sw
URL: http://
Depends on:
Reported: 2003-07-18 10:54 UTC by ingenstans
Modified: 2013-08-07 14:41 UTC (History)
1 user (show)

See Also:
Issue Type: DEFECT
Latest Confirmation in: ---
Developer Difficulty: ---

Example .sxw file (5.04 KB, application/octet-stream)
2003-08-14 16:29 UTC, caolanm
no flags Details
example for qa (5.04 KB, application/octet-stream)
2003-08-15 17:33 UTC, caolanm
no flags Details

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Description ingenstans 2003-07-18 10:54:31 UTC
Words which have had their case changed, either by autocorrection, or by use of 
my case-changing macro (in the url above) lose this change of case when exported 
to Word format. This makes the resulting documents look very sloppy and 

steps to repeat. 

start a paragraph without a capital letter (see above). Correct it to title 
case, using my macro. Export to word. Reopen in Word. The letter will have come 
back down to lower case. It is still in lower case if the doculemnt is reopened 
in OOo.
Comment 1 h.ilter 2003-07-18 15:26:51 UTC
Reassigned to JSK
Comment 2 ingenstans 2003-07-20 08:56:12 UTC
Bob Long on the user list checked, and I have confirmed, that title 
case is not exported to Word even when applied via 
format->character->title case.

parenthetically, this is the fourth bug I have found in the 
implementation of title case. It really must have been written on a 
Monday morning. 
Comment 3 oblong 2003-07-20 10:15:20 UTC
Some more on this case business. It seems that the Font 
Effects|Effects change only the *appearance* of text within OOo. For 
example, if you enter ABC (in capitals, using the shift key) then 
you will see ABC. And if you use font effects to change it to, say, 
lowercase, or title case, then you see lowercase, or title case, as 
appropriate. But the underlying characters are *not* changed. 
Conversely, entering abc in lower case, then using the effect of 
capitals, shows capitals but does not change the "real" characters. 
This can be seen by saving as HTML, or as pasting as unformatted 

I discovered this when trying to use a regular expression to replace 
words that were all capitals by italicised lowercase. As I'm pretty 
raw with REs, I thought I was doing it incorrectly. But it turns out 
the document (originally a .doc made by someone else) was using the 
capitals font effect.

Without the underlying characters being changed, I can't think of 
how to successfully change case and have the expected case available 
for something like HTML output or an unformatted paste. 
Comment 4 ingenstans 2003-07-21 11:08:59 UTC
There are two problems here. One is the problem of export to other 
formats -- html and plain text as well as word: presumably all export 
formats are affected. Here it seems to me incontrovertible that the 
export filters should change the case of the underlying characters

The second problem comes, as Bob has noticed, with cutting and pasting 
text. That's a little more complicated. Because I presume that the 
justificaiton for having a charcasemap at all is something to do with 
non-ascii charsets. Put presumably the unformatted text that is placed 
on a clipboard should be changed just as when it's exported to a 
proper file format.
Comment 5 joerg.skottke 2003-07-22 09:01:03 UTC
I think this has absolutely nothing to do with the macro recorder.
Interpreting the additional comments i think this is a flaw in the

Back to hi.
Comment 6 ingenstans 2003-07-22 10:01:07 UTC
Quite. It has nothing whatever to do with the macro recorder, and 
macros only come into it because it was by using a (hand-written) 
macro that I discovered this flaw. The changed case is not exported 
however the change is made.
Comment 7 h.ilter 2003-07-28 14:22:33 UTC
HI->CMC: The font attributes seems not to exported correctly.
Comment 8 caolanm 2003-08-05 10:58:15 UTC
Word doesn't have have a "title" character format, our title format
caps the first letter in a paragraph, word doesn't have a feature like
that, we'd have to turn in into an actual "caps" format on the first
Comment 9 caolanm 2003-08-14 16:29:55 UTC
Created attachment 8463 [details]
Example .sxw file
Comment 10 caolanm 2003-08-14 16:31:04 UTC
Ok, seeing as word doesn't have the feature we'll make the filter
turning the affected characters into their uppercase equivalents when

Done in limerickfilterteam08 for OOo 2.0
Comment 11 caolanm 2003-08-14 16:32:48 UTC
Comment 12 ingenstans 2003-08-15 15:15:53 UTC
cmc: thanks for that. The next question is whether you can modify the 
upper/lower case settings in OOo to export real upper case/lower case 
letters both to word and to ascii text. 

This is not quite the same as word's deficient title case. It crops up 
in other contexts, such as when Writer autocorrects sentences that 
start with a lower-case letter. The correction is not preserved on 
export to ascii, for example. Again, this looks some journalists look 
like sloppy fools when they submit autocorrected ascii files in which 
half the sentences start with lower case letter. anyone would think we 
were idle or ignorant. that is a terrible thing.

Perhaps this is someone else's job. But I don't consider the issue 
fixed until all the charcasemap formatting changes are preserved on 
export to formats that dont support a charcasemap type property. 
Because the root of this problem is a failure for that to happen.
Comment 13 caolanm 2003-08-15 15:31:58 UTC
When writer autocorrects it does replace the character with an
uppercase equivalent, it doesn't toggle the title or other char
property, so I don't see this behaviour with text autocorrected to
have uppercase. 

So the normal autocorrect case works fine for me saving to text and
.doc and so on.

It only arises when there is a char property on the character. Word
has the caps property so that's ok. Granted the export to .txt should
probably do the same thing as was done for title case here. Buts
that's suprisingly tricky as the ascii filter doesn't work with any
properties at all. Nevertheless its a good point, write a new bug for
export of all caps/title case/small caps to .txt. A quick check of the
competitor show that that works for them.
Comment 14 caolanm 2003-08-15 17:33:25 UTC
reopen to reassign
Comment 15 caolanm 2003-08-15 17:33:50 UTC
Created attachment 8484 [details]
example for qa
Comment 16 caolanm 2003-08-15 17:34:31 UTC
cmc->mru: Change title case to real uppercase implemented for .doc in
Comment 17 michael.ruess 2003-08-28 12:44:06 UTC
Checked with internal CWS filterteam08.
Comment 18 michael.ruess 2003-08-28 12:53:27 UTC
Verified. The "Fix" will be available in OO 2.0.

Andrew, be careful: an import of the exported title characters will
not be possible. As CMC pointed out, Word does not have such a
feature. This means, thew characters will be loaded as normal upper
case chars into Writer, not as chars with the "title" property.
Comment 19 ingenstans 2003-08-28 20:30:17 UTC
I think this is what I asked for: that a word in Title case (ie with 
the first letter upper case and the rest lower) is exported to word in 
that way. 

Will this also be true with export to ascii/html? 

The difference, as I understand it, is that is that in real title 
case, if I type "word" then "Word" appears; and if I later add an "s" 
letter at the start, "Sword" appears (the S is capped up, and the w 

Obviously that can't be preserved on export to formats that don't know 
about title case. In those formats, after export "Word" should appear, 
with the initial cap; and the expected behaviour if I add an initial 
lower-case s is to get "sWord". Not perfect, but no longer the fault 
of OOo, which at present exports "word". 

Anyway, thank you for spending the time on this.
Comment 20 michael.ruess 2004-04-01 15:04:07 UTC
Checked integration in 680m32.

Andrew, for similar feature in ASCII/HTML export, please file new "enhancement"
issues. These (though both seem export issues) are different code places to work
on, so it will be necessary to file new issues. Thanks for your patience!