Apache OpenOffice (AOO) Bugzilla – Issue 71142
Failure of 'Move sheet' to delete original
Last modified: 2013-07-30 02:47:36 UTC
Move sheet should act like copy followed by delete of the original. I found that the original remained. Here are the steps I took: 1. Open the first spreadsheet. 2. A dialog appears asking if I want macros. Click 'Enable macros'. 3. A dialog appears asking if I want to update links. Click 'Yes'. 4. Open the second spreadsheet. 5. A dialog appears asking if I want macros. Click 'Enable macros'. 6. A dialog appears asking if I want to update links. Click 'Yes'. 7. In the first spreadsheet, go to the Edit menu, select 'Sheet', 'Move/Copy'. 8. In the 'Move/Copy sheet' dialog go to the 'To document' drop down and select the second spreadsheet. 9. In the same dialog there is a unchecked box marked 'Copy'. Leave it unchecked. 10. Click 'OK'. 11. The first spreadsheet becomes empty, close it and discard changes. 12. The second spreadsheet now contains the first worksheet. Save the changes and close it. 13. Look in the folder and see that the first spreadsheed is still there.
Hi, sorry to ask, but do you really think this is a valid defect ? You just removed a single sheet from one file and pasted it into another one. After that you close the source file and throw away all changes you've made to the document. Consequence is that you have the original file at the place there you've opened it from. This is exactly what you've requested. Also and mainly you have done an action in the file not *on* the file. Such actions are done by the OS's and never by an application. This would be a simple erase action on the file. So I close this Issue as invalid. Frank
closed invalid
Aha. I see what is happening now. It is a confusing user interface. If it is as intended, then it is an error of the user interface. I started with one sheet, moved one sheet, and ended with one sheet. In arithmetic terms it appears as if: 1 - 1 = 1 Since there are other defects around this task (71147, 71143), I think it could do with some more people looking at it before it is closed. I see that the user interface is clearer in Excel because it starts with three sheets and goes down to two. I am not suggesting that is the solution but I would like other people to see this. I have reopened it but changed it to ui. As is common with UI matters, it is difficult to know if this is a defect or an enhancement. I will leave that to others.
Hi, so your description is unclear. Please attach the documents you mention. Frank
Created attachment 40316 [details] Screenshots of UI issues with 'Move sheet'
Created attachment 40317 [details] Screenshots of UI issues with 'Move sheet'
Attachment enclosed (id=40317) above. Ignore the previous attachment(id=40316), I failed to state the file type.
Hi, according to your initial comment the Issue is invalid as Calc did exactly what you wanted it to do. Your latest comment with the JPEG attched, shows a different behaviour. IMHO Excels way to silently close a file which is altered in such drastical way is bad style. The only positive thing in this behaviour is that Excel does not alter the file itself. As we are not an Excel clone, the behaviour for some tasks may varry. In this case we copy the sheet and leave the document open leaving the decission to close the file to the useer. BTW if you have the sheet altered before moving it, Excel did not save the changes before closing the file. But you may need the information in this file also. I don't like such behaviour, do you ? Anyway it's not my decission anymore, let's User Experience decide. Matthias, please comment on this one. Frank
Hi John, thank you for your very detailed explanations. That saved me some time to understand what this issue is about. Let me first add some details that are maybe not quite clear between you and Frank. a) Excel does not remove the *file* when the last sheet is moved to another document. But the document window closes and keeps the file on the harddrive untouched (=same state as when opened or last saved.) b) OOo Calc does not remove the sheet when there is just one sheet left. In this case the check box in the Move/Copy dialog is marked and disabled. That means that the last sheet cannot be moved -- it can only be copied. You main concern is that OOo's behaviour is confusing to the user. Let's -- for a moment - compare apples with oranges: In Excel, under some circumstances, a document window closes without confirmation alert, neither was the closing triggered by any close menu command. Hmm? What happened to my window? What is the state of the file? I am confused. In OOo Calc the Move/Copy command really moves my sheets from document A to B as long as a sheet reamains in document A. Strange, sometimes the command moves the sheets, sometimes it copies the sheets. I am confused. Let's focus on OOo. Your concern is that users try to move a sheet a second time because it was obviously not moved -- it is still in the source document, right? From my point of view this is a visual feedback problem 1) because a disabled checkbox is easy to overlook 2) because the created sheet in the target document is to selected. We will not change the 1st behaviour -- this would get us into the MSExcel confusion. But we might change the 2nd aspect. If the created sheet is selected (visible in the target document) then I expect less confusion on the user side. No one does the math ("1-1=1"). But everyone cares for her data. Let the user decide when to close and save a document; and make it obvious what happens by bringing the sheet in the target document to front. What do you think? Matthias // User Experience Engineer Set prio to 4, Type to Enhancement
Matthias wrote: "Excel does not remove the *file* when the last sheet is moved to another document. But the document window closes and keeps the file on the harddrive untouched (=same state as when opened or last saved.)" I just checked, you are right. Thanks. Matthias wrote: "In Excel, under some circumstances, a document window closes without confirmation alert, neither was the closing triggered by any close menu command." So I see. However, I did not notice. Perhaps this was because it matched closely to what I wanted it to do. Clearly my mental model was false. I can see the point that you are making. Matthias wrote: "Your concern is that users try to move a sheet a second time because it was obviously not moved -- it is still in the source document, right?" I only mentioned that as a symptom. But it would be interesting to fix that. Matthias wrote: "2) because the created sheet in the target document is to selected. If the created sheet is selected (visible in the target document) then I expect less confusion on the user side." Yes. That would be a good improvement. The focus should move with the moved object. Note that the moved object retains focus at the start and end of the task. I move an egg from an eggbox to the fridge door. My task starts with me looking at the egg in the eggbox. It ends with me looking at the same egg in the fridge door. I do not just see it disappear from the eggbox and have to go to the fridge to check if it got there. Thanks for your clear thinking and for pointing out stuff I did not see before.
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