Issue 87261 - No accessibility events generated when viewing a presentation (workaround available)
Summary: No accessibility events generated when viewing a presentation (workaround ava...
Alias: None
Product: Impress
Classification: Application
Component: ui (show other issues)
Version: OOo 2.4 RC6
Hardware: All Unix, all
: P4 Trivial (vote)
Target Milestone: ---
Assignee: AOO issues mailing list
QA Contact:
Keywords: accessibility
Depends on:
Reported: 2008-03-19 17:38 UTC by richburridge
Modified: 2017-05-20 11:08 UTC (History)
4 users (show)

See Also:
Issue Type: DEFECT
Latest Confirmation in: ---
Developer Difficulty: ---


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Description richburridge 2008-03-19 17:38:47 UTC
See Orca bug #523228 which is blocked by this problem.

Steps to reproduce:

1. View a presentation in Impress
2. Press F5 for Slide Show
3. Move among slides with Page Up/Page Down

Expected results: Orca would speak and display the text on each slide.

Actual results: Orca does nothing.

(The need for this support was raised at CSUN)

See attachment to Orca bug:

From this you can see we are getting no accessibility events as
you Page-Down through the presentation slides.
Comment 1 eric.savary 2008-04-07 09:33:54 UTC
Reassigned to WG
Comment 2 wolframgarten 2008-04-07 11:58:01 UTC
Comment 3 malte_timmermann 2008-06-12 17:46:00 UTC
MT: We should evaluate if everything is available and accessible in the new
presenter console.
Then that should be enough, IMHO.
I doubt that the blind presenter has any need to get text positions in the slide
show mode.
All pages can be "evaluated" in normal mode, so in slide show mode only the
content should be critical.
And he can also rely on his notes there.

I will ask Orca team for opinions.
Comment 4 joaniediggs 2008-06-12 20:48:53 UTC
I happen to be talking to Mike on the phone about this right now and we're not
clear on what you mean by "text positions".  i.e. exactly what is it that we
won't have access to in slide show mode?
Comment 5 malte_timmermann 2008-06-13 20:16:13 UTC
Presenter console seems to have the same issue wrt to AT support :(

We need to evaluate how best to fix it, and what exactly to expose.

e.g. when giving a presentation, someone might be more interested in getting the
notes instead of 1:1 content.
Maybe as a accessible description?

To be discussed...

Comment 6 groucho266 2008-06-16 08:52:29 UTC
The problem of the presenter console and AT support mentioned above is this:
The presenter console is an extension and therefore can only use the UNO API to
provide any AT support.  However, the API does not allow this.  One has to
derive from the vcl Window class and overload CreateAccessible() and that is not
possible for an extension.

One possible fix, specific to the presenter console, would be to provide some
sort of loop hole by e.g. providing a private API, using a tunnel, or by using
some generic interface to pass an XAccessible implementation from extension to
the full screen window in which the presenter console is displayed.  This would
be, clearly, a hack.

A better approach, one that would be usable by other extensions as well, would
be an extension to the API that would provide something like a
XWindow3::setAccessible() method to set the accessible object for any window.
Comment 7 malte_timmermann 2009-09-16 14:02:30 UTC
As discussed earlier, we are convinced that full AT support in an active
presentation view doesn't help much, and that the presenter console is much more
helpful to the user.

The presenter console was made accessible in #	i102525#, so I will downgrade
priority and target of this issue.
Comment 8 malte_timmermann 2009-09-16 14:04:17 UTC
P4, OOo later
Comment 9 malte_timmermann 2009-09-17 12:08:43 UTC
Some documentation here:

=> "AT support while giving a presentation "
Comment 10 williewalker 2009-12-04 15:42:09 UTC
ww->mt: "As discussed earlier, we are convinced that full AT support in an active
presentation view doesn't help much, and that the presenter console is much more
helpful to the user."

A common interaction style users have on Windows is that they bring the full
screen mode up and the screen reader will then read the entire slide as the user
pages up/down.  This behavior is highly desired and highly helpful because the
user only needs to know the page up/down keys.

So, some sort of event(s) when the slide changes would be highly desirable so
that a screen can then do a "SayAll" of the slide content.

Comment 11 joaniediggs 2010-05-18 00:57:43 UTC
joaniediggs->mt, all:

Just in case it wasn't clear from other comments about why this bug was filed....

There are plenty of people who are blind who have excellent skills using
presentation software. They can use the presenter console. But we're not talking
about them. There are plenty of people who are blind who, though they may lack
familiarity with presentation software, have excellent computer skills and can
figure things out. But we're not talking about them either. Not in this bug.... :-) 

In this bug, we're talking about folks who are blind and only have basic
computer skills and have just been given a presentation as an alternative and
supposedly-accessible format. They have no clue whatsoever what to do with it.
At all. None. Not even if their very lives depended upon it. Seriously. But they
want to read the content. So they press Return on the file's icon and find
themselves in PowerPoint or Impress.

Based on my 14 years of DayJob as an assistive technology specialist working
with folks who are blind, including woefully under-skilled users, here's what
happens next: They start Tabbing. And eventually they get to an object with
text. How do you read a text object? Well, heck, you arrow. So they start
arrowing. But the text isn't getting read to them. And to make matters worse,
the text object is now moving. And if their screen reader announces this fact,
which they typically do in Windows -- and which Orca will hopefully start doing
very, very soon -- these users are even more confused and frustrated. All they
wanted to do in the first place was read this stupid presentation they received
at this stupid conference and why isn't their stupid screen reader letting them
do that?

For this particular class of user, what you tell them to do is:

  1. Press F5
  2. Press Page Up/Down to read the previous/next slide
  3. Press Escape when you're done

Problem solved. Presentation gets read. The user is happy. It's all good. At
least for PowerPoint users.... We want to be able to provide that same,
headache-free, just-open-the-file-and-read access to the occasional presentation
for *nix users.



Having (finally) had the opportunity to sit down and work with your fix for
issue 90690, I'm happy to announce that Orca (git master) is now presenting a
lot more information than it was before to *nix Impress users who are blind.
Thanks for your work on that! 

Given the P4 status of this bug, I'm going to see if I can use the accessibility
goodness you provided for 90690 to accomplish what I describe wanting above, but
via the slide pane. At least that way, users could arrow Up/Down to read slides,
and not be in danger of moving objects around accidentally.

Nonetheless, it would still be nice (really, really nice) if there can be found
some way for y'all to emit enough information to us when the user is moving
amongst slides in regular, extension-free slide show mode. After all, folks
coming to us from Windows are bringing with them what they learned there.... 
They will be trying the "F5, Page Up/Page Down, Escape" thang. And they will be
expecting it to work.

I'm very sorry to be a pain. Much appreciation in advance for anything that can
be done on this one.
Comment 12 joaniediggs 2010-05-18 02:33:41 UTC
Best-laid plans....

Turns out that I cannot currently provide easy, just-read-the-slide access in
Orca via Slide pane navigation as I'm not seeing any events. Just opened issue
111667 for that.
Comment 13 Marcus 2017-05-20 11:08:33 UTC
Reset assigne to the default "".