OK, have you a proposal for who should replace them?

I understand the importance of Marcon’ｓ aim.
The current state of work for "Get Legal"campaign is as follows In Japanese
community. 

-Mira(He is member or ja-translation-project) translated campain page.
-Now reviewing this translation.
-ASAP, We will distribute this page to Japanese.

We discuss this work for "Get Legal"campaign and ja-marketing activity in
ja-disuccs ML.
Khirano, Please contacut to ja-disuccs-ML, If you want to accelerate this work.
We can find the cooperator in ja-disuccs ML.


**Japanese comment
Marconの重要性については、理解している。
"Get Legal"キャンペーンの作業状況は下記のとおり。

- Miraさんが、キャンペーンページを翻訳してくれました。
- 現在、レビュー中
- 可能な限り早く、このページを公開する

マーケティング活動と"Get Legal"キャンペーンの作業については、ja-disuccs MLで話し
合っている。
平野さん、この作業を加速したいなら、ja-disuccs MLにコンタクトして欲しい。
そこで協力者を見つけることができるでしょう。

khirano --> jpmcc

I have a proposal that I shall replace them.

But it seems that Yutata Kachi wants to continue to be a marcon and so he
replied to my email.

I am waiting for Ikuya Awashiro's reply.

khirano: Could you please explain your point more directly?
         Do you want to be a marketing contact (Marcon) in place of them?
         http://ooosmp.homelinux.org/GoalsandObjectives/MarketingProject

This is my understanding of you. You cannot be the marcon. 
As you know, marketing contacts should be a person who can talk to the 
community. 

Your recent behavior, e.g. observed in the issue 65375, reveals that you 
could not be the person. It is your humanity. Your point in the issue sounds 
good, but the process you did was strange enough. Please think of why your 
talk was not convincing. Please do not think your opponents were fool to 
understand your talk. 

I would like to propose this issue as INVALID after hearing khirano's 
explanations.

In addition, please explain why you filed this issue without any discussion 
in the discussion mailing list of Japanese community?

Members of Japanese native language project have been working together using 
the mailing list. For this kind of important topic, we should discuss within 
the local community first, right? After we reach at conclusion on replacement, 
someone who represents the Japanese community posts an article to the 
dev@marketing to announce the replacement instead of filing an issue.

> I would like to propose replacing two ja marcons, Yutaka Kachi
<catch@openoffice.org> and Ikuya Awashiro <ikuya@oooug.jp>, because any task of
"What do Marcons do?" and of recent very important campaign "Get Legal" have not
been done by these two marcons at all.

Don't tell a lie!

They have ever done many tasks as a marketing contact. In fact, they conducted
conferences, seminars, booths, meetings and a press brifing. You can cofirm
these achievements from 
http://ja.openoffice.org/marketing/event/index.html   (Japanese)
Mr. Kachi particularly traveled all over Japan for seminars to spread
OpenOffice.org. His works is adimrable.

They also responded to indivisuals, organizations and presses that contact to ja
N-L project. In fact, they published news releases in Japanese when new versions
of OpenOffice.org were released.
http://ja.openoffice.org/servlets/SummarizeList?listName=announce

As regards "Get Legal" campaign, it will be ready in the near future as Mr.
Kachi described.

khirano: I'm disappointed in you. Do you want to confuse Japanese community? Is
there any person who is qualified for MarCon? If there is something you don't
like about current Japanese marcons, help and support them or introduce a more
qualified person. It seems that you are just slanging.

jpmcc: Please don't believe what khirano wrote. He was just back-stabbing Mr.
Kachi and Ikuya.

Thanks for referring to i65375, which solved the question of abusing the ooo
lists.  Good one.

Now it's good that we all here regard marcons as important roles.
Yes, they are important because they are the integral part of "Strategic
Marketing Plan."
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Strategic_Marketing_Plan

It's a good chance for us to read it through, especially "11. Goals and
Objectives" followed by "11.1 Usage Goals," "11.2 Marketing Objectives" and
"11.3 Marketing Project."

If you read "11.3 Marketing Project,"
http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Strategic_Marketing_Plan#Marketing_Project
you can see that "Project Leads" are responsible for recruitment of and liaison
with MarCons.

Yutaka Kachi is willing to continue to be a marcon to do its tasks.  That's
fine.  Let us see.  This will give "Project Leads" an idea when they recruit a
marcon.

Now let us wait for another ja marcon, Ikuya Awashiro.  We have to listen to
what he would like to say about this issue here.

khirano: As you often do in the community mailing list, i am doing the same 
         response as you do:

   Answer to my questions first! Otherwise do not change a subject.

This is the way you usually do. Feel it and lean it.

   Again, why do you file this issue without any discussion in the local 
   Japanese mailing list? 

tora: my comment above has already answers your question.
The issue of marcons is the issue of the marketing project.

khirano:
OK, you think you have already answered to the questions. 
I am afraid, but I do not think so.

Anyway, if you want to be a marketing contact or one of the ones, 
you will definitely need to be recognized by the local community. 

Otherwise, no one in the community will hear you. 
Don't you think so?

What you first have to do is to start a discussion on this topic 
in the local community. You have not yet done that at all.

The worldwide marketing project will never assign a marketing contact 
to a person who has not been recognized in the LOCAL community. 

Actually I started discussion on "Marketing Contact" from Feb. 15.
http://ja.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=discuss&msgNo=11443
On this thread Yutaka Kachi said:
http://ja.openoffice.org/servlets/ReadMsg?list=discuss&msgNo=11455
"つまり、連係するのは仕事がどかんと増えるだけで、それほどのメリットはないような
気がするのです。" which means:
"In short, if we work in liaison with (the marketing project), it only increases
our works and doesn't benefit us that much."

But now he says in his comment above:
"I understand the importance of Marcon's aim."

This is good.  Hope he accomplish his marcon tasks.

And we are still waiting for another ja marcon, Ikuya Awashiro, what he would
like to say about this issue here.

khirano: OK, 

  If you just want to have a title, please stop your activity on this topic
  immediately. You cannot make it unless you change your behavior. 
  A marketing contact has to be capable to communicate with local community, 
  but your current behavior actually ignores them.

  If you think the campaign is really important, please give them your hands 
  and join the discussion again to accelerate the campaign with your innovative 
  ideas. You must have a good strategic plan because you said that 
  "I shall replace them" in a response to the question by jpmcc.

They have been really busy for writing articles for magazines, preparing for 
a presentation in the upcoming LinuxWorld Conference & Expo/Tokyo 2006, 
establishing a new firm based on open source software, and so on. 
Because they are the individuals who people want to have.

Those might be the last words that i could tell you.

Let's discuss on the campaign in the local mailing list in Japanese and 
please explain why you think the campaign is paramount and let people 
know your innovative ideas.

jpmcc: could you please take care of this issue in an appropriate way 
       if this kind of waste-of-time discussion is lasting?

I am not interested in the title.

I don't think that this issue is a kind of waste-of-time discussion.
We have deepened our understanding of the marcon role.

Now it is very important to listen to another ja marcon, Ikuya Awashiro.

Then we can give an idea to "Project Leads" who are responsible for recruitment
of and liaison with MarCons.

*** Issue 69807 has been marked as a duplicate of this issue. ***

jpmcc:
in #i69807#, ycatch says that:
------------------------------------------------
Please delete "Yutaka Kachi" from ja-marcons.
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html

I have famliy ploblem and I will not spend ja-marcons work.

Thank you for your co-operations.
regards
------------------------------------------------
he seems that he changed his mind.

ycatch: please do not raise different issue for the
exaclty same issue. otherwise others cannot track the issue,
and induces non-transparency in the process.

thanks

add Cc: maho

There has been no activity and no response from the current ja marcon.  If there
is no objection from the current ja marcon, and the Japanese Native Language
Project Lead approves, I would be happy to replace him to get marcon job done.

maho as the JA NL project lead approves.
thanks

I've emailed Ikuya Awashiro <ikuya@oooug.jp> to ask him formally if he wishes to
hand over to Khirano.

Confirmation received. I'll update the web page and make the announcement 
tonight.

http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html updated. Please check that I have
spelled your name and email address correctly (!) and then close the issue.

John

John,
Thanks for the update.
http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html
My name and address are correctly spelled out.

Verified.

Thanks, everyone, for your help.